That Orange Toyota

“How a 13-year old boy brought down the Night Stalker!”

This story is one of many articles that claim something or someone directly led to Richard Ramirez’s capture. As with everything the media has told you about the Night Stalker, the reality is a little different. Bill Carns and his girlfriend Inez Erickson (sometimes named as Carole Smith) survived a Night Stalker attack in Mission Viejo, Orange County, California. James Romero, a 13-year-old neighbour was rewarded a small motorbike and some money after spotting a man prowling around his house, before escaping in an orange Toyota station wagon. Eagle-eyed James memorised the licence plate and the police found the car, helping them catch Richard Ramirez.

It is a nice end to a horrible story, a young lad giving police that missing puzzle piece in the manhunt, but James Romero actually lived 1.5 miles away from the Carns home. He was not a neighbour. Bill Carns lived on Chrisanta Drive and the Romero family lived on Via Zaragosa at the furthest point possible from the Carns house.

A child seeing the back of a man in a baseball cap, on his front lawn, in the dark, a mile from an attempted murder does not prove that man was the attacker.

James reported the prowler to the police (nothing to do with hearing about a local murder, but because someone was sneaking about on their property). He described the orange station wagon with a cargo rack and gave a partial licence plate of 782 I.

Later, in Los Angeles, 50 miles away from Mission Viejo, a 1976 orange Toyota station wagon was stolen from Bill Gregory in Chinatown. A man reported it to the police after seeing the news story about the car seen in Mission Viejo. This car was later found four miles away in a parking lot on South Alexandria Avenue in Koreatown (locked and neatly parked).

Its licence plate read 482 RTS.

The Netflix documentary shows us archive news footage, comparing the stolen car’s plate to the one given by James Romero.

Only 8 and 2 are matches. And even if it was the same vehicle, James did not see this car anywhere near Bill Carns’ house. Later news reports claimed the boy’s identification was much more accurate, and that he only missed the R and the S off.

You might also notice that the composite shows the 3-door variant of the car, whereas the LA car is a 5-door.

Break it all down and we end up with very little evidence at all.

  • A boy sees a prowler driving an orange car in Mission Viejo.
  • A man and a woman were attacked elsewhere in Mission Viejo.
  • A car theft 50 miles away in LA.
  • Numberplates that do not match.

It is said that Ramirez’s latent fingerprint (invisible to the naked eye, and unable to be found through dusting) was found on the interior mirror, which seems suspiciously convenient. Suspicious because the way they identified Ramirez’s fingerprints through a special new computer program seems to be a myth. They were actually examined manually, which is unreliable and subjective. The evidence listed above is circumstantial and unconnected, so of course, they had to connect it with an invisible fingerprint, just like they used the Avia shoe at the ‘Uncharged Incident’ when they were unable to use the child cases.

Because Carns’ girlfriend did not want to testify a second time (she had testified at the preliminary hearing and admitted she never saw the gunman’s face). The Carns attack never went to trial so we will never know if the fingerprint evidence could be refuted. Although we do know that if Ramirez had been represented by Ray Clark or the Hernandez clowns, they definitely would have forgotten to bring their own expert…


Did Richard Ramirez really drive such a car?

If you read the testimony of Ramirez’s burglar associate Sandra Hotchkiss, she claims that she and Ramirez were driving an orange Toyota station wagon that was involved in an accident, on an unspecified date in 1985. If the car James Romero saw was Ramirez’s car, why was it not dented? If the vehicle dumped in the car park was his, why was it not also dented?

Because it was not the same car.

Then there are the child molestations of which Ramirez was falsely accused. One boy, aged 9, said he had been kidnapped from Montebello in an orange station wagon, but that was not Ramirez unless he was 5’9”, medium build and blonde…

Therefore, that was also not the same car. Not only that, shortly after the theft, its owner received scary silent phone calls to the church he worked at (his work phone number had been left on paperwork inside the car). Richard Ramirez is not associated with crank calls (that’s more the Golden State Killer’s thing), so this points to an unrelated crime.


It was because of James Romero’s description that a hat was added to the composite sketch and detectives then tried to link it with the hat found at Okazaki (and by extension, Carrillo’s extraordinary serial killer hypothesis) as if Richard Ramirez was the only man in California to wear baseball caps.

This is so ridiculous.

Everything about Richard Ramirez is unique’. The only man with an AC/DC hat, the rarest shoes in Southern California, the unique orange station wagon, the only man who used red primer bullets, the only satanist, the only person with bad teeth, and so on.

From the little evidence we have access to, nothing connects Ramirez to the attacks in Mission Viejo. It is all smoke and mirrors. But James Romero was hailed as a hero, flown to Los Angeles for a press conference, awarded money, game tickets and a quadbike for “bringing down the Night Stalker.”

James Romero and his reward

-VenningB-

22 responses to “That Orange Toyota”

  1. It’s awful what happened to Bill, I honestly do feel bad for him. But did that girlfriend of his really positively Identify Richard as her attacker, or was it more like one of those “I didn’t really see him too clearly” and they were all “don’t worry about it, we already got a good idea what he looks like, just tell us what he did” ?

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    1. It’s difficult to find out what she said – most articles on this incident are vague and ramble on about all the other crimes. Because Richard was never tried for this crime, we don’t get to see the initial police statements. The only thing I could find was an interview where she said she never saw his face, but identified him from his posture and voice.

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      1. Get your facts from a source that is reliable, and, knows the accurate timeline of events as they occurred. 

        Inaccurate information is an insult to the victims and the families. A laundry list of misinformation to mislead and confuse. I was there. Know the facts and how they unfolded day by day. Bill is my brother. And; deserves more respect than what I have read.

        Best: Kate

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      2. Hi! It’s impossible to obtain reliable sources for a case that never went to trial, so we did the best we could with the limited information that comes from the press and documentaries. We can only go by what is publicly available. We are not trying to disrespect Bill Carns; that is the last thing we want to do. We are merely stating that the ‘witness’, James Romero, lived too far away to be a genuine witness. If there is misinformation, it comes from journalists. Those journalists were quoting from the preliminary hearing and the police.
        Most of what we write (apart from the untried cases) come from legal documents and police statements. It is not our fault that there are many holes in the Night Stalker case and it’s not our intention to offend victims at all. We are not just pulling this out of thin air. If you want to add more insight for us, we are happy to read it and add more details to our posts.

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      3. No one is discounting what your brother or any victims experienced. He deserves justice, as all victims of crime do. Our information mostly comes from legal documents and reports. Except for the cases Ramirez wasn’t convicted of. For those, we utilized the few resources available to us which include newspaper sources and interviews. We are very transparent about the information we present. Unlike many individuals that have profited and continue to profit from Ramirez’ story, we have nothing to gain. We relay the information in an unbiased fashion while attempting to expose the numerous instances of reasonable doubt. We would like to have additional trustworthy sources of information about the crimes Ramirez wasn’t convicted of but that have been attributed to him. Unfortunately, there is limited information available.
        We will gladly look at any information you are willing to share. Respectfully, K.

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    2. My next post will probably be about this incident… although I don’t know much more than I did when I last replied nearly a year ago haha. But we can’t leave it out.

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  2. No one that writes on this blog is discounting what any of the victims experienced. Yes, it was all horrific. However, that doesn’t make what happened to Richard ok by any means. What happened to him was terrible and a miscarriage of justice. The victims deserve truth and justice. But so does Richard but for far too long we’ve been fed lies and a false narrative. It’s time the truth is told.

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  3. I’m pretty sure it was a partial print found on an exterior mirror on the orange Toyota. Correct me if I’m wrong. No prints were found inside the vehicle. This vehicle had been abandoned in a parking lot, exposed to the elements and to passer-bys for several days before it was found. Did police find other prints on this vehicle ? Were there any unidentifiable prints? This sounds similar to the Vincow case. How does a fingerprint on a car mirror indicate someone committed rape and attempted murder? How does someone identify their attacker by posture and walk? How does a 13 year old kid seeing a trespasser while playing around with his motorbike indicate that individual committed rape and attempted murder ? It doesn’t. None of this adds up.

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  4. I laughed so much when the documentary fused the plates together and they were all, the partial plate matches the plate of the stolen car! Incredible!

    Yeah, 2 numbers match. I can’t tell you the number of Ford Fiestas of the same color as mine that have a couple numbers that are identical to the ones on my Fiesta’s plate. Station wagon cars were just as mainstream, my dad drove such cars till the mid 90s, and there’s really nothing unique about them. You’d see them everywhere because they were oddly affordable and very handy as most people traveled by car.

    But most importantly, even if that was Richard driving around, it doesn’t connect him to the attack. Perhaps he was really looking for a house to commit burglary, as we know he did that for a living basically, but everything else is a big stretch that you really need to back up with some evidence.

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    1. If this had gone to trial, one would hope the defence would produce data on how many Toyotas of that type or similar were imported to the USA, how many went to California and how many had those two numbers on their plates. But his defence probably wouldn’t consider such a thing.

      Weirdly, the documentary is the only place I can find the merging of the numberplates footage. On YouTube, clips only show the actual one, as do most articles. So all we have is a car, seen in the dark, the back of a man, again, in the dark. Prowlers aren’t unique and James Romero even admitted they had their garage burgled before, so this evidence is just rubbish. Even if Richard stole the car found in L.A. that doesn’t prove the boy saw it. Also, given the location of the boy’s house, street lamps aren’t close to the property (the nearest is diagonally across the street). So how do we know he definitely saw an orange car, not a red one or tan brown in that poor visibility? These colours were popular in the 70s/80s.

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      1. This is really something that bothers me the most; everyone seems to have seen everything, but at the same time not, but at the same time in the dark, BUT at the same time they all know it was always Ramirez.

        The real crazies are still laughing their butts off…

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      2. Another one that bothers me is the Petersen case. Virginia said she saw a man with an angular face and an athletic physique and she knows this because the TV was on in her 4y/o daughter’s room at 4am. But then she said she thought he had gloves on because his hands looked distinctly lighter than his shirt. Yet at trial she said he had clean manicured fingers and wild hair and on TV said his face was unforgettable. Then also at trial she claimed a lamp was on in the living room meaning she saw him clearly. Yet she also didn’t leave the bedroom until the killer left and found her husband playing dead on the floor and that man had been in the shadows. The only thing she could see was the shine of his pistol. So which is it, dark or light? Did he have gloves or not, combed or wild hair? Why couldn’t her husband ID him despite chasing him around the house and being fired at?

        She saw him and didn’t see him all at the same time…

        Liked by 1 person

      3. Okay, no, that entire case sounded like a sci-fi movie when I was watching the documentary.

        The Night Stalker, so good at massacre by nature, breaks in, shoots two people, misses vital organs on both, gets yelled at and chased after… Yet they can’t even agree on who did what and who looked like what, but according to Salerno the Night Stalker even paused to stare and call the husband a “bitch.”

        Again, it could have been someone they knew who had a score to settle with her husband, considering how he was unable to identify him at all. It doesn’t have to be a serial killer.

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      4. And despite the gun failing to kill (because of old “unique” red primer bullets) he supposedly uses the same gun two days later 57 miles away. And the gun succeeds in killing. Since the Night Stalker carries a whole cache of weapons like a Grand Theft Auto character, why didn’t he switch it out for another pistol?

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      5. Because, according to Carrillo, the guy was a coward…

        I don’t know, nothing makes sense the more you try to find a reason!

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      6. Carrillo claims Richard told him he brought two guns to every crime scene. So explain why he didn’t use a second gun when one failed or why he chose to smash people with household objects when it’s quicker to shoot?

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      7. Also am I a bad person for laughing at the police statement where she’s outside and knocking at the neighbours house naked?

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      8. She did what now 😂

        Actually, I think I’m mistaken, it was Salerno who stated the Night Stalker was a coward, like he even said something about regretting it because it was all over the news shortly after.

        Sounds to me like they conveniently had an excuse for anything that didn’t match the no-pattern pattern. This case annoys me mostly because it’s a bunch of dudes theorizing instead of analyzing the evidence they collected, and yet they managed to keep their jobs and still make profits.

        If Ramirez had been a supreme serial killer, then really show us how—it would be evil, sure, but it would also have been interesting. This… it’s just ridiculous.

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      9. Yeah the documentaries on him never give insight into his motives. Just “look at these clever police”, “wow rare shoes” and “something something bad Miguel teaching him to kill”

        They keep saying he was the first killer in history not to have a pattern and no one finds this suspicious.

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    2. What bothers me about this Romero identification is how the boy now recites exactly the same clothes Carrillo insists the killer wore, almost verbatim. “Dark baseball cap, black Members Only type jacket, black shoes.” How would the boy have seen what brand of jacket this prowler was wearing? He’s been told the stolen car’s numberplate, he’s been told what he wore, and now he remembers it as if he saw it when it was not possible.

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      1. Black shoes! On a man who’s last seen inside a car and had been prowling in the dark?!

        How can you read the Members Only tag, it’s a small one?!

        Imagine rewarding a kid with a bike because he sent someone he didn’t even come face to face with to the gas chamber.

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      2. Apparently he did see Richard at the preliminary hearing and he claims Richard winked at him!!

        I’m sure a Members Only tag is on the front too and he only saw the man from the back/inside the car. This is ridiculous.
        He also got tickets to games and money and the police bought him dinner. Really over the top.

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